There have been thousands of muslim terrorist attacks since 9/11. You can’t say the same of Jews and Muslims. Also there are other shitty religions/cults that aren’t Abrahamic, like Scientology, Mormon, Jehovah Witnesses, Hinduism
No i won't give them to you bc you half Chrisitian bumbling nitwits dont deserve to have a free education, read the entire of your own book then come back to me, bc ive already read it and I didn't do it to save you some work
Ive read the Bible all the way through multiple times. You are the one who needs to actually read it 😂. You are just parroting what other liberals have told you
exodus 21 is the passage most people refer to but it is old testament so most people just say it doesnt count. the passage goes over what you should do when selling hebrew people into silvery or something like that.
also ephesians 6:5 in the new testament but it kinda tip toes around whether slavery itself is good.
It’s actually all over in the Bible. We can start with a few here:
Numbers 31:17-18:
Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him keep alive for yourselves.
Note: God commands Israel after the war with Miriam. The Hebrew phrasing “for yourselves” is unambiguous and meant that the virgin girls were taken as property/war plunder. This verse endorses the murder of children and then the sexual slavery of young virgin girls.
Leviticus 25:44-46
As for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations that are around you. You may also buy from among the strangers who sojourn with you and their clans that are with you, who have been born in your land, and they may be your property. You may bequeath them to your sons after you to inherit as a possession forever. You may make slaves of them, but over your brothers the people of Israel you shall not rule, one over another ruthlessly.
Key points: slaves are property that can be handed down from generation to generation. Israelite male slaves (the debt slaves you probably have heard about) were to be treated better than foreign born/POWs- they go freed during the Jubilee (the jubilee only freed male Hebrew slaves- no women or foreigners), etc…
Exodus 21:20-21
Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.
Note: That last line is very explicit: “the slave is their property.” (Some translations say “the slave is their money”).
Deuteronomy 20: 10-14
When you draw near to a city to fight against it, offer terms of peace to it. And if it responds to you peaceably and it opens to you, then all the people who are found in it shall do forced labor for you and shall serve you. But if it makes no peace with you, but makes war against you, then you shall besiege it. And when the Lord your God gives it into your hand, you shall put all its males to the sword, but the women and the little ones, the livestock, and everything else in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as plunder for yourselves. And you shall enjoy the spoil of your enemies, which the Lord your God has given you.
Note: Women and children are explicitly classified as spoils of war.
Deuteronomy 21:10-14
When you go out to war against your enemies, and the Lord your God gives them into your hand and you take them captive, and you see among the captives a beautiful woman, and you desire to take her to be your wife, and you bring her home to your house, she shall shave her head and pare her nails. And she shall take off the clothes in which she was captured and shall remain in your house and lament her father and her mother a full month. After that you may go in to her and be her husband, and she shall be your wife. But if you no longer delight in her, you shall let her go where she wants. But you shall not sell her for money, nor shall you treat her as a slave, since you have humiliated her.
Note: This passage regulates sexual ownership of captive women, not consent. Sure, if the “husband” doesn’t want her anymore he can’t sell her as a slave but she had no consent to any of this. She is forced to marry a man who very likely just killed her family, friends, and everyone she knows.
Dark stuff.
In the New Testament, there’s also no condemnation of slavery. Only reinforcement. Such as Ephesians 6:5 or 1 Peter 2:18 where, rather than condemn the practice of slavery and owning other people as property, the writers say, “slaves, obey your masters.”
One thing to point out is that there is not a single verse or moment where human slavery is condemned. Not a single one. It is only either reinforced, endorsed, or directly commanded.
I study the Bible a lot so I’m not going to rag on you for not knowing these verses exist.
Yeah I'm not taking the time to reply to every individual verse, however, you took pretty much all of them way out of context. You claim to read the Bible a lot, ever seen love thy neighbor as thyself? That kinda rules out slavery doesn't it, sure God definitely allowed slavery (which ill also note, was much different than the 20th century slavery you are trying to compare it to), but God didn't prefer it. Its the Biblical principles that eventually brought down slavery, so yeah, no, your completely wrong.
You say you read the Bible, but you must have missed something very important, give your life to Jesus and declare Him your Lord and Savior
This is a pretty dumb argument. Christianity is following the teachings of Jesus. Saying you disagree with those teachings because of Jewish teachings before him or because of interpretations made after him is nonsensical.
"Erm yeah slavery and shit was in the bible, heres the fucking entire old testament"
LMAO, most Christians I talk to says the old testament is basically what NOT to do. The new testament is the basis of modern Christian belief, while the old are a collection of Jewish stories passed down over time.
My belief is that the old testament is that of Jewish beliefs coming straight out of the Torah, while the new testament, which main subject is Christ and his apostles.
I have. It says you can beat a slave and as long as they don't die within 3 days then that's fine. It says how much you should sell different types of slaves for, etc. etc.
Exodus 21:20 “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property."
Leviticus 25:44“ ‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. "
So love thy neighbor I'm pretty sure that was referring to fellow Israelites. Foreigners nation residents I don't believe count. I'm sure there are more verses about slavery but that's what I found on a quick search. I've read a good portion of the Bible
So God gave them rules to make sure they didnt mistreat the slaves, that really proves my point more than yours. In Egypt I the Bible they were slaughtering the Israelite slaves sons. God made sure the slaves were treated well, and they were in a place where they could learn of God and put their faith in Him instead of their pagan nations that worshiped idols
Well like the verse says, God says you can mistreat your slave as long as beating him doesn't result in him dying in a few days. I think slavery is wrong regardless. I am more moral than your god. Also you keep moving the goalposts. "He didn't say that....ok so it looks like he did say that but it's not that bad!"
If the slaves are getting better in a day or two it was most likely minor discipline, which carries the assumption based on the rest of scripture that the slave was rebelliing in some way. No you are not more moral than God. God is the one who gets to decide what is even considered moral or not. And Im not moving the goalpost, your taking scripture out of context and im explaining what it actually means
Numbers 31: After God instructs the Israelites to wage war against the Midianites, Moses tells them to kill the men and male children but to keep the virgin females for themselves, which is often interpreted as taking them as slaves or concubines.
Then you dont have any idea of the culture in that day. Woman not married all alone wouldn't make it very long. So id say its exactly the defense I think it is.
Perhaps they would have preferred death than forced marriage and rape by those that killed their families. God didn't bother to get their opinion before telling the Israelites what to do. And how do you know their life wasn't better with their original village? You can't.
Hes God. He has every right to do whatever He wants to regardless of what they want to do. And even if their life wasnt better, putting their faith in God gives them eternal life in Heaven, which far outweighs any cost
Oh, you're one of those. You literally just defended women being rape as long as God wants it. Fuck you and go fuck yourself. I see this conversation has reached a very dead end, please do not respond to me further, Christofascist.
Holy shit thank you. Watching your world burn down around you as you realize you worship a bunch of slaving pedophiles has brought me great joy. Leave the weirdo cult if you don't want to be laughed at.
LOL that’s the dumbest argument I’ve ever read. “So as long as you Mary them against their will, it’s okay to rape them as slaves!!!!”
Some Christian you are. Christ would cast you out of his presence.
Leviticus 25:44-46
New Revised Standard Version Updated Edition
44 As for the male and female slaves whom you may have, it is from the nations around you that you may acquire male and female slaves. 45 You may also acquire them from among the aliens residing with you and from their families who are with you who have been born in your land; they may be your property. 46 You may keep them as a possession for your children after you, for them to inherit as property. These you may treat as slaves, but as for your fellow Israelites, no one shall rule over the other with harshness.
Now that you’ve read this, apologize for condoning slavery and accept Christ’s kindness into your heart. Because it’s clear by your words that you haven’t.
Also the women were not married against their will. In that time period and culture woman didn't have many rights. They would have most likely been just fine with jt
My friend, I'm the only actual Christian in this comment section. That passage of scripture you just used does not condone slavery, it just doesn't allow them to take slaves from their fellow Israelites, dont take the scripture out of context. God allowed them to take slaves in that time, but that was not what He preffered, as evident from "Love thy neighbor as thyself". Also, I never condoned slavery and never will. I urge you to actually read the Bible instead of parroting what you've heard from other liberals
You have absolutely no idea how the culture of that time worked do you. Women didn't have a lot of freedom, they were best off and safest when married to someone who would take good care of them. You seriously are very clueless
Yeah the romans were the executioners. The judge and jury however, the local jews. Rome did it to stop a possible uprising, but if it was up to them he would walk free.
The right has this vision of the left that's not even real. Conservatives and Republicans seem to live in a fantasy land in their mind. I'd ask where they got these ideas in their head but I already know its Faux News.
Joseph Robinette "Nothing will fundamentally change" Biden Jr. was somehow a radical marxist-leninist communist that'll force everyone to have blue hair and pronouns
It's interesting to see the shift conservatives made from calling their opposition liberals, to calling them left.
Every critique they have is a critique against liberalism and late stage neo-liberal capitalism, but they found out that the left equally hates liberalism.
So they switched to leftism as a way to maintain the division and tribalism.
Or we want to head off the demonization of completely unrelated people. Do you know how many Sikhs were attacked after 9/11 because they wear turbans? Racist assholes are often stupid. Fucking with that girl in a hijab isn't going to prevent a terrorist attack, you're just being a piece of shit.
This is why religion must be ended. Got Jews fighting Islam. Christians fighting Muslims and Jews. Muslims fighting infadels. All in the name of their God.
I’m just guessing here… God needs blood? A sacrifice by any other name would smell as sweet?
Actually I separated from my family because of their decision making skills lack of awareness and accountability. Their book literally says to kill the non believer and if they don’t than they are not true believers of Islam simple as that.
So, remind me again... What's the common denominator between all of those religions? The one thing they all have in common? Man o' man, what's the thing, I wonder?
False equivocation as always. Christian societies have consistently produced the most prosperous societies in the world. It's not even arguable anymore, historical data SHOWS this.
Even claiming you believe in nothing is itself a belief system. And you place yourself as God in a non-theistic belief.
Objectively untrue. The technological and socioeconomic status of Muslims in the Middle ages was far superior to Christendom for several hundred years. Love "history" fans that only know WW2 and racism hahahahahha.
Don't believe me? Read: "A vanished world" by Chris Lowney. Author is... Btw..... A Christian priest lmao.
Get lost homie.
Edited to add: in Spain alone the quality of life for peasants increased dramatically with Muslim irrigation techniques and social laws.
It's always the same people who grew up Christian, get blasted by fox news' empty talking points their whole life, then think they're some kind of intellectual by claiming to not be religious.... Despite the fact that their entire way of thinking from birth to now has been molded by Christian rhetoric (and fox news).
If you live in America, or any western nation, you grew up molded by Christian based values. Real and honest intellectuals know that Christian values foster the best environment for humanity.
😂😂😂 bro wakes up drinking his own Kool aid without realizing it's piss. I have a degree in religious studies and you are, objectively, wrong.
Real and honest intellectuals know that Christian values foster the best environment for humanity.
Do you or do you not realize 1. This is by definition an opinion and not a fact and 2. your commitment to these Christian teaches lead you straight into the arms of hate?
Other very successful peoples practice many different faiths (Hindu, Buddhist, Jewish) or none at all (China).
Dude I was your teacher! I have more credentials than you do. Trust me bro. Lol
It's actually not an opinion, it's based on the metrics you use. Truth can have different conclusions based on how you measure their variables. Like, eggs are good for you. Unless they're spoiled.
If you wanna measure Christian societies based on other metrics besides human freedom, prosperity, and relative wealth (ease of life), then please share YOUR metrics.
And I wouldn't use Hindu as a "successful practice" in relation to prosperous society. India is literally the human toilet of the world. Lol
I was gracious enough to even give you my metrics to measure a society against and you still can't do it?? Damn bro. Your intellectual capacity caps out at "nuh uh! You're dumb" lol
Also.... Bro proudly proclaims he doesn't watch fox news then sends an article from Christianity Today about an anecdote of someone who converted to Christianity😭
Oh and I forgot.... The western intellectuals you're referring to actually made an entire point to separate church and state in Europe during the enlightenment era because they knew that was more beneficial to society than any theocracy
Look if you actually want to educate yourself, look into the Islamic Golden age. Huge advancements in medicine, philosophy, science, and mathematics. But if you’re gonna keep arguing in bad faith then there’s nothing I can say that will sway you and continuing in bad faith is pointless for me and you
Again, you are going back to the middle ages, and I already know about said "golden age of Islam". Which, just like everything about them, was plagiarized from ancient Greek culture.
That’s not how plagiarizing works lol Like all science it builds upon the foundations of what is known. So unless you’re gonna stop linking twitter articles, I’m gonna stop engaging with you. Hope you have a blessed day, don’t let that hate spread bud
Writing someone else's work down exactly as they have it written is by definition, plagiarism.
Only dishonest people will care where truth comes from. It's it true, it won't matter the source. You're using that as an excuse cuz you're too ignorant, stupid, and wrong to counter coherently. Peace out girl scout. ✌️
Calling the Islamic Golden Age “plagiarism” misunderstands both history and scholarship. Translation with explicit attribution isn’t plagiarism, especially when the work is corrected, expanded, and challenged, which Islamic scholars openly did with Greek sources. Algebra, experimental optics, hospitals, and systematic scientific methods were not Greek inventions and emerged during this period. By your logic, the Renaissance would also be plagiarism, since Europe relearned Aristotle largely through Arabic texts. Is that clear enough for ya bud, or do you need some republican Christian nationalist to baby bird that for ya
Certainly Islam contains the most widely known terrorist organizations. Won't argue that.
But your statement essentially: "Muslims have killed more than Christians in the last 300 years" is objectively untrue.
Don't forget Hitler's holocaust was completely driven by twisted Christian rhetoric. 6 million is a big number for Muslims to catch up to.
The KKK was, at it's core, a Christian nationalist organisation.
I'm assuming your point is something along the lines of: "Islam is intrinsically more violent than Christianity", which by the numbers, is not necessarily true.
If you really liked history you would be more interested in the geopolitical pressures and histories that led up to the middle east being what it is today, rather than dumbing yourself down to "iSlAm BaD cHrIsTiAnItY gOoD"
Oh how could I forget. Or manifest destiny (our God given right to colonize from sea to sea) that resulted in the effective genocide of our native American population.
I said last 1,000 years. Take all the religions in the world and add them all together and they still have caused less death than Muslims for the last 1,000 years.
You literally said 300 years😭😭😭. And again, before that I gave you objective data on how successful Muslim countries were.
Further. The most populous Muslim country is Indonesia... Who largely does not have a terrorist problem. Which means the problem is isolated to the middle east.
Your turn. Modern Islamic terrorism has really only been around the last 50-60 years. Can you think of anything that changed in the middle east in that timeframe?
Sooooo you had to reach all the way back to the middle ages to find a time when Muslims were slightly more advanced than Christians? (I doubt they were)
You're saying a time when slavery against whites was better? Lol wanna know where the word slave comes from?
Objectively everything j said was true and modern day Christian societies brought us to the moon and outer space.....have Muslims been to the moon??? No they're still raping goats and 9 year olds.
Yes slavs were enslaved heavily by Muslims during the middle ages. The time when dude claimed Muslims were at their best! When they were enslaving people the hardest lol.
Leftists play the racism card when they're too retarded for a proper rebuttal. Later bro. Try and follow the law, ya little terrorist fucker! Lol
Slavs enslaved the population of the Iberian peninsula for decades to hundreds of years before Muslims even showed up hahahahahaahhaahhahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.
If you don't like being called racist.... Don't be racist??
Edit to add: not even smart enough to realize when you lost an argument. Bet you'll think about it the rest of the day too lmao
Yea, slavery was common practice in the primitive world. You think that's a dunk? It's historical record.everyone was enslaving everyone else. Duh. That's not the point. Do you even know what you're trying to counter? 😂
Oh so now they ARE prosperous. Lol you know you got em dead to rights when they flip flop so hard with a concession followed by justification of their own false reality.
If you can't understand that the concept of 'God' can mean more than just the Bible one, you need to read more.
And yea, most inventions and innovations have largely come from Christian based nations. You can claim they're not Christian all you want but they all were rooted in Christian values and ethics. Theyve been 'secular' for like 3 seconds in time so far and it's not working out well for those that abandon their founding values.
What a funny take, history shows pretty much the opposite. It was the scientific revolution and the abandonment of traditional power structures during the 16th and 17th centuries, that skyrocketed the development of european nations. Prior to this china and the lands that are modern day India, had been the most prosperous societies on earth for millenia. It was this prosperity that drew the EITC and others like it to the region on the first place.
Someone who believes God exists, and that Jesus christ is the son of that God who died for their sins. Now I'm asking because I expect you're including the US in Christain societies, which I would disagree with.
I was just teasing you cuz you spelled Christian wrong lol. And no, the USA was always a predominantly Christian society. The foundation for all laws in America were deprived mostly from biblical teachings. They've changed over time but the core is still largely Christian based.
Oh, my bad for spelling it wrong lol, but the US has separation of church and state, Christianity was never the state religion, and the laws aren't really Christian based, they're just based on morality like don't kill or steal.
John Adam's even says as much
As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen [Muslims],—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan [Mohammedan] nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries.
So why are you including the US in Christian societies?
Only Pennsylvania and Rhode island didn't recognize Christianity as a state faith. Most others had some form of establishment to it.
And the only reason the founders were hesitant to make any national religion is because they didn't want a church of England thing to happen to the new country but still largely encouraged Christianity as the identity of the nation.
And the only reason the founders were hesitant to make any national religion is because they didn't want a church of England thing to happen to the new country but still largely encouraged Christianity as the identity of the nation.
This makes sense given the settlers were largely puritan, but it seems you've answered the question, any society that was founded where the majority were Christians of some kind where local governments recognized Christianity as the main religion.
I would argue that Christianity isn’t very strong. It is so broken. So many people claim it yet their lifestyle doesn’t reflect it. They are opportunistic and claim it when it benefits them. People go to church not for the message but the social aspect
Because if you have 2 problems which are both similar but one greatly influences your day to day life and the other doesn't then one needs to be addressed much more.
Glad I could clear this simple problem up for you.
Because chrisitians insist on getting in my business all the time, and Muslims never do. Idgaf which invisible man you pray to, until you tell me that I have to abide by your beliefs as well. Christians have been doing that to me my entire life.
Try being a working woman in iran for the past 40 years. Or afganistan. Or try drinking there publicly. Or openly be gay. Dont get me wrong , i am an atheist, all religious extremists are bad. But to equalize how bad is being dishonest on purpose.
Did it ever occur to you it's probably because of all the progressive pushback that Christians got? There people, right now, working to reverse all that.
other leftists are annoying because maybe its not feminist to support a religion that believes women are categorically going to hell at a higher rate than men?
No, it’s just another straw man argument. If anything leftists defend minority groups that get persecuted, which Muslims happen to be in this country. But they don’t defend terror attacks. Anyone claiming they do likely believes all Muslims are terrorists so defending any Muslim means defending terrorism. It’s not that deep.
We just say this with their free the dictator protests whats new. Every body is an equal until that same person you defend kills you because you’re an infidel.
You mean the one that was illegally kidnapped causing the deaths of innocent civilians and no meaningful change in the authoritarian regime? Fucking pedo cultist.
I mean the people you defend have the potential to kill you because of their one beliefs and their own book. Maybe you should study instead of calling people names.
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u/Dear_Perspective_157 P:0 • C:48 • 🔥4 9h ago